Now Playing: Order Out Of Chaos
Posted by Jeffrey K Radt ("JRed") | Posted in America In Prophecy , Bible Study , How Close Are We? , New World Order , One World Government , Political Signs , Prophecy Basics , Spiritual Deception | Posted on Monday, November 23, 2009
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I'm just going to apologize to some of you right now because I know this isn't going to be a popular position I'm going to take.
As always, my intention is not to offend any of my fellow brothers and sisters in Christ and I certainly do not want to create internal debate within the Body of Christ to the point where it divides us. All that being said, I also cannot remain silent on a subject that I've seen everywhere lately.
From now on, whenever I write about something 'political' here in this forum it will be assumed that we're all on the same page in understanding that what we're in the midst of on a moment-by-moment basis is a spiritual war disguised as a carnal, earthly, physical one.
The spiritual element involved in just about all facets of life is becoming more and more obvious by the day. That's why I wish to try and expose it for what it really is whenever possible, and try to prevent people from being blinded by their own passions to the point where they can't see things for what they really are.
Again, we need to view EVERYTHING through a Biblical worldview, and therefore see it as a spiritual issue -- not an earthly one -- or else we'll run the risk of being deceived and playing right into our common enemy's hands.
It's a few weeks old, but after seeing this article the other day (see the link below) I recalled what we postulated back in June when Honduras erupted into a full-blown political crisis.
The headline read:
Former White House Speechwriter Suggests Military Coup Could Oust Obama
I wonder if this is the sort of thing that prompted several Western leaders like President Obama to immediately protest the ouster of the Honduran President because they feared the same fate could await them. That's neither here not there. What I do want us to look at though is the bigger picture. This idea of 'ousting' the President and creating civil, cultural, political, religious, social unrest as a result is nothing new. In fact, I'd argue that it's been the theme of 2009.
The evolution of this 'Revolution Meme' is fascinating to me. Not because I take any morbid interest in watching political dissension spill over into the streets of any particular nation (especially my own if that were even possible), but because we have yet another example of how things seem to be going according to plan as far as those serving as agents of Satan are concerned (whether acting as knowing or unwitting agents, the result is still the same).
"Ordo Ab Chao" / "Order Out of Chaos" is their mantra, right?
We know that's true -- not just from what they admit to us about what they believe, but mainly because the Holy Bible confirms that to be the case!
Think about it. The Antichrist will rise to power as an individual who will have all the answers to all the world's problems. He will come onto the scene at the precise moment when the world is seeking a Superman figure to sweep in and sweep them off their feet. They'll want him to pick up all the broken pieces and all the broken people in the world and put everything and everyone back together in a New Order that is simply too good to be true.
Folks, that can't happen unless the present 'life-as-we-know-it' ceases to exist. The current system must be replaced by a new system in order to help pave the way for those prophecies to be fulfilled. To reiterate, not only are we being told that this is what those in power who serve Satan want to do to us, but we're being told the very same thing every time we open our Bible and read the Book of Daniel or the Book of Revelation. Why? Because this is a spiritual issue and a spiritual war being disguised as an earthly, social-political one.
Haven't you thought it strange how President Obama went on-and-on during his historic Inauguration Speech talking about the American Revolution and the Revolutionary War? At the time, I remember there was a very brief discussion about how 'odd' and 'out of place' it all was given history in the making, and given the times we are living in. Have a look and a listen:
President Barack Obama's Inauguration Speech
Soon after, Gerald Celente took to the airwaves every chance he got (he still continues to do so to this day!) telling us all about how the 'Second American Revolution' and/or the 'Second American Civil War' is inevitable:
Gerald Celente: The Revolution Is Coming!
Gerald Celente: Civil War? Preparing For The Worst
Gerald Celente Predicts US Dollar Currency Crisis In 2010
Right on cue, we had the Tea Parties spring up all around this nation fueled by regular folks like you and me, and this coincided with the popularity of Glenn Beck on Fox News:
Chicago Tax Day Tea Party: What CNN Did Not Show You Behind The Scenes
(WARNING: Some Foul Language)
Glenn Beck And Penn Jillette On MIAC Report
Soon, politicians on both sides of the aisle emerged to voice similar displeasure with the federal government (some as recently as earlier today):
Ron Paul: 'We Need To Wake Up'
Alan Grayson: Grilling Bernanke
It was refreshing to read Another Voice's take on this entire subject today when they highlighted another new and related development called 'The Manhattan Declaration':
The call for civil disobedience is coming from every side, including the now-uniting religious world with their new 'manifesto'. This is truly a proverbial killing of two birds with one stone - a chance to further the NWO-mandated merging of religions, and preparation for instigation of chaos, aka 'civil unrest', all at the same time.
Ron Paul's "End the Fed" groups are in the streets today, protesting nationwide [see: NWO 'End The Fed' Scam To Take To The Streets 11-22-09]. They may very well be the 'advance guard' of NWO team chaos. Last week's 'Continental Congress 2009' have now prepared, as of today, a "formal Notice as to the 'Civic Actions' of (peaceful) resistance" [see link below], which they plan to deliver to the U.S. Government - another 'manifesto' for civil disobedience. Big question here in regard to all this current and pending civil disobedience: Cui bono [who benefits]?
The tyrannical designs of the global would-be monarchs alone will benefit through the disruption of the status quo, unfortunately. The existing order must be destroyed before the 'new' order can replace it.
The NWO strategists are 'taking it to the streets'. Do not be caught up in the scam, and be aware, because this disruption of society phase is a clear indication of just how late in the NWO game it is. Rev. 18:4
compare: History In The Making - Continental Congress Convenes To 'Hold Government Accountable' November 11-22 '09 "The real-world problem with this is that 'civil unrest' greatly serves the purposes of the NWO (so-called). How better to further destabilize the existing order than to begin to instigate widespread civil unrest and then come in with the iron fist? Never forget, it's always 'ordo ab chao', i.e. order out of chaos." [see post, follow links, connect dots]
I must say that I think the analysis is spot on. Furthermore, I really don't know what else to say if you're someone who reads that and still walks away from this piece with the same feelings and thoughts that you had before stopping by.
My dear brothers and sisters in Christ, we need to seriously contemplate the spiritual nature of what's going on right now. Pray about it. Seek the Lord and ask Him to reveal the truth to you about all of this. Look, I'm not saying that the types of things people like Beck, Celente, Ron Paul, and the Tea Party demonstrators are saying are 'wrong'. Gosh, I'm not even saying I disagree with their political views because I don't! I share their sentiments.
However, that does not mean that we should allow ourselves to become whipped into a social-political frenzy here because we're only doing EXACTLY what The-Powers-That-Be are hoping we'll do in response.
Don't believe me? Well, consider the suspicious implications stemming from the report that Bob Basso met with President Obama in a private meeting shortly after the President took office.
Who's Bob Basso? Bob Basso is the author of "Common Sense" and he plays the role of Thomas Paine 'to ignite the fire of change in America'. His videos are all the rage in the so-called 'Patriot Movement' as you can see here:
We The People Stimulus Package
The Second American Revolution
I'm supposed to believe that Basso being summoned to the White House so that President Obama could "try to censor a private citizen expressing his 1st Amendment rights" was a legitimate description of what that meeting was all about? Right. I hate to sound 'conspiratorial', but when you read the Bible and understand that the whole history of mankind is nothing but God's story of how He saved His children from that conspiracy it's a little tough to take a news story like that at face value.
Still don't buy the argument that The-Powers-That-Be are salivating at the thought of you and I taking to the streets or engaging in a Second American Revolution/Second Civil War? Here's proof from just the past few days:
Rachel Maddow: Frank Schaeffer Discusses Religious Hatred Towards Obama
Missouri Billboard Incites Violence
Fitting (or further evidence of this 'conspiracy') that this billboard comes to us from the good old state of Missouri -- the origin of the now infamous MIAC Report that started it all? Yep, we've come full circle now, haven't we?
Sadly, I rest my case.
Now, you tell me if you still think there isn't an orchestrated, highly sophisticated collusion between various segments of the government and mainstream media (energized by an Antichrist spirit) at work here in all of this.
So, what is our response to such knowledge? First and foremost, our most powerful weapon to wield is prayer. If you call yourself a Christian and don't believe that then something's wrong. You might want to check to see if the 'Check Engine' light is on, and you might want to check under the hood at once.
All kidding aside, I'm not writing that as some sort of a holier-than-thou Christian. Are you kidding me!?! Lord knows I am a wretched sinner who's still learning how to walk with Him daily, depending on Him and Him alone for all provisions. Still, that doesn't mean we shouldn't take a good hard look at ourselves in the mirror on this topic even if we already know we won't like what we see.
I need to reiterate that I'm not saying I disagree with such political sentiments. Their is gross incompetence at the highest levels of government and our elected officials on both sides of the aisle aren't doing the job we hired them to do. I also need to point out that I'm not promoting some type of carefree attitude either where you just throw your hands up in the sky and never get involved in politics. I'm simply suggesting that we need to take a step back and see government, politics, and the political debate for what it truly is an extension of the spiritual realm disguised as an entirely earthly body.
Yes, we can effect change by participating, but I cannot advocate any type of 'revolution' or violent protest as a response. If relying solely on God rather than solely on myself and other fellow Americans makes me 'soft' then so be it. I guess I'm soft then.
In the end, it's hard to refute the fact that this is an entirely spiritual concern disguised as an earthly and political one. We'd all be wise to remember that it's God who gives is exactly the type of leader we deserve, and the type of leader who will help to fulfill His ultimate plan for a nation, it's people, and the world at large:
Daniel 2:21 (KJV) And he changeth the times and the seasons: he removeth kings, and setteth up kings: he giveth wisdom unto the wise, and knowledge to them that know understanding:
May He grace us all by 'giving wisdom unto the wise, and knowledge to them that know understanding' so that we can view and respond to what's going on around us appropriately as He would want us to.
You gotta see this short video
Here is something to consider with all you have said today. There is a common destination all these events are leading to, and I am not only speaking of the coming of Jesus. One aspect I don't here too much about here is the Jewish one. Consider that they have all that is needed now to build their third Temple and conduct sacrifices. Their expectation is that their Messiah is going to show up when the Temple has been built. Not before. What better timing for the anti-Christ to show at the very same time the
Temple is completed and that Jesus takes us up. He (anti-Christ) will satisfy the Jews need for what they believe to be the Massiah, have a ready explanation as to why we are gone and bring peace to the world all at the same time! This is the destination all the events you are talking about will lead up to.
I'm not saying I have the inside scoop on this, after all we are all on the sidelines watching this unfold. Now they've crowned the President of Rome (EU), it will only be a matter of time for the full economic collapse, One World Order and currency, the bombing of Iran, and the gog magog attempt against Israel.
Just some things to think about.
Nick
Third_heaven_investigations@Yahoo.com
Good post J,
Good post.
bba
God is in control not man. We are to submit ourselves to authority and leave everything to God. Consider how David dealt with King Saul. That is our model.
Warmly Mrs M
JRed....check out history. This is how the Russian revolution occured. The power people responsible for the first revolution then turned right around and swooped in with their "iron fist" to put communism in place. If the people had known what was going to happen there would never have been a first revolution or it would have been done differently. Then check out how many died shortly after that as "communism" solidified it's power. Right on brother. History is repeating itself. I defy you to find in any text book in use today in Amerika's public schools, and of the historical facts concerning Russia and the revolutions. It was barely taught when I was in school. We've been "dumbed down"...bible is full of warnings about this. And the rest, so they say.....is history!
Amen, amen, amen, Jeff! This is ultimately about taking a viewpoint above and orthogonal to the classic left-right, us-them fights of the world. Satan doesn't much care who wins; he just wants more yelling and less calm, quiet contemplation of eternal truths.
If we are angry about what the government is taking away from us (and there is no question that it is doing just that) we need to consider in our hearts precisely what it is that we're so attached to and whether those things are eternal or temporal.
If I'd been in the Garden of Gethsemane with Christ, I have little doubt that my first impulse would have been to hack off the ear of one of the Roman guards, as Peter did. And yet Christ chastised him for it.
Some may retort that this is the kind of attitude that got us WWII and that let the force of evil roll on over Europe, to which I would again say: Go up a level. Pray earnestly. God may well direct you (or many of us) to march in the streets. But then again He may tell us to go like lambs to the slaughter. I just don't know. He does.
What I do know is that He is in control and that if we're inclined to do something counter-Biblical we'd best question the source of that impulse... to question exactly where our orders are coming from.
Keep up the great work, Jeff, and Happy Thanksgiving!
An observation as to the "ousting" of Obama, if and when that ever happened. Joe Biden is a devout Roman Catholic. Tony Blair, Angela Merkel and many other World leaders are Roman Catholic as well and were all just invited to visit the Pope about religion and politics. It is important to note that the new and first EU president, Herman from Belgium, is a devout Roman catholic. Interesting? I bet it will be when Peter the Roman comes along pretty soon.
Civil disobedience can be as simple as a Christian doctor saying he will not perform abortions irregardless of the written law of the land. Ultimately, it will mean we will not take the mark of the beast. Let's be clear that civil disobedience is not the same thing as rioting or violence. It will mean standing up and doing the right thing which could result in punishment according to their laws. We are held accountable to a higher law and a higher power. If these actions had been taken 20 years ago, they might have made a difference. Now it is a case of too little, too late.
As for the Manhattan Declaration being a forerunner to the dreaded One World Religion, I look at the names of the people who signed and others who openly endorsed it. If I had seen Rick Warren, Joel Osteen or some other names, I would have not hesitated to jump to the same conclusion. I have read the declaration and find nothing objectionable in it. There is a time coming for believing Christians that denomination and traditions will not matter, and we will become more like the First Century church. Absolutely nothing wrong with that. Many are "going back to basics" and looking at where we should be and what we should be doing as the Bride of Christ. It is never too late to be the light in the world that Jesus has called us to be. The battle lines are being drawn and to finally have a group of Christians say we have retreated, but will do so no longer is frankly refreshing and welcome. We are Jesus' hands and feet and are His warriors. So let us put on our armor and join the fight (through prayer) and quit retreating. To me that means living every day like Jesus' sacrifice means something!!
You are spot on and I got swept up in the whole "9/12 Movement" until you look at what they believe and I am unable to escape the fact that Glenn Beck is a professing Mormon. Plus, Ron Paul's stance on homosexuality. Our eyes need to be on the Lord Jesus Christ than fallible man.
The whole governmental body is corrupted by Satan and there is only one guy out there as far as I can tell that knows this far too well. Alex Jones, the "so called" conspiracy theorist makes it an effort to let people know that the WHOLE GOVERNMENT IS CORRUPT. He doesn't have all the answers but he is one of the most honest non-partisan speaking person I have heard ever.
Check out some of his documentaries on YouTube.
Fall of the Republic
ENDGAME : Blueprint For Global Enslavement
TERRORSTORM: A History of Government Sponsored Terrorism
Check out his website at www.infowars.com and see for yourself if he is speaking the truth.
JRED right on first time I've heard anyone get it right. Then to end the chaos the military will come in a take our weapons away and conservatives and christians will be the new terrorists. They still need the North American Union and the Asian Pacific Union though, to complete the 10 horns, but it could be completed faster right after the chaos and after opposition are removed to camps or even death.
This post was refreshing! Thank you! I've long been disturbed by the "patriot" mentality, but still thankful for the gleaning that can be found in some of their stuff. "Kingdom now", is still the effort of man, and Christ will destroy the anti-christ with the spirit or breath of His mouth and the brightness of His coming. (2 Thessalonians 2:8) Christ will do all the setting up, every effort of man is bankrupt, that is the point!
Where can anyone hide from God?
I totally agree! And it is so obvious that THEY want chaos to start- they are probably surprised it hasn't yet, so that THEY can create that 'order out of chaos' or New World Order. It seems to me THEY will push and do whatever THEY can to create people into a choas and panic whether it is pandemic induced, political, economical or spiritual. Either way, whether we sit and do nothing, or declare a revolution we will be playing into THEIR hands. Only God, if His timing is not now, can stop the ball that does not look like it will stop rolling....
gibby62 has it right. Battle lines are being drawn. We didn't draw them. Who do you serve, and who is your provider? The time for compromising may be over. And Christians have compromised to the point of losing their saltiness. There are many Christians in our local public school system, but there is really little evidence that they make a difference when it comes to key moral issues. Same with our local hospital.
What does the Bible say about being luke warm? Time to go HOT or Cold.
NO KING but KING JESUS!
good comments, all; thnxs.
Im feeling somewhat stupid waiting for something ,a disclosure, Im not sure, with Thanksgiving, or filled stadiums that day, Im not sure,
..I wait for HÃs door opening - who cares about the other doors ..how much more possibly He can postpone ..? Tell me ?
praying for all You dears
Plus in addition to the Patriot mentality and uprising, the government is not worried at all with the reality of GWEN and HARP technology in place (do a search on startpage.com about them). Let's not forget Project Paper Clip and Monarch programs where civilians are sleeping agents waiting to be activated.
Anonymous #14,
"Who do you serve, and who is your provider?"
If I have to dignify that with an answer than my work here has been in vain.
Friends, like I said in the beginning of this column, I don't mean to cause a fierce debate on this or divide the Body of Christ. I just want to sound an alarm and give a warning that we need to be careful.
There's nothing wrong with the principles stated in The Manhattan Declaration. I agree with them as stated 100%. It's a noble and worthy effort.
However, we need to be VERY CAREFUL because there's an extremely fine line between 'civil disobedience' (which proclaims that as Christians we oppose such immoral anti-Christian institutions and policies, but still rely on God to secure the outcome) and 'protest' (which proclaims through individual actions that as Christians we oppose such immoral anti-Christian institutions and policies, but instead of relying on God for the outcome we somehow fall prey to thinking we can create the outcome ourselves).
After all, how is relying on God through prayer and simply understanding that these times we're living in were foretold since the beginning of time 'retreating' or an 'act of cowardice' to some?
I don't think I'm advocating a 'lukewarm' mentality or behavior, but merely pointing out again how VERY CAREFUL we need to be right now. I just think that all this protest is having a negative effect that too few of us realize or see. I agree with gibby62 in that 'civil disobedience' does not have to mean 'rioting or violence'. Still, we must be on guard b/c it's subtle how civil disobedience can become twisted in that it makes us rely on ourselves rather than God for the right kind of moral change this country needs.
Also, please don't think I'm just sitting on my hands either because my hands are the most active parts of my body in this war -- they're constantly folded in prayer.
Saved By Grace Through Faith,
Jeff (JRed)
JRed, I think the who do you serve question was rhetorical!! We should all ask ourselves that question and hopefully will provide the answer already in the Bible, "As for me and my house, we will serve the Lord."!!
HUGS, brother and keep those fingers working (in prayer and on the keyboard)!!
gibby62,
No, you're right, and I assumed as much at first.
But then I remembered how there's been a definite 'spike' in 'hate mail' coming my way lately in response to the things I've been writing.
Surprisingly, and what I hope isn't a new trend because it would be disturbing, a majority of that 'hate mail' has been coming from other brothers and sisters in Christ, and the tone has definitely been 'loud' and 'angry' indeed.
Anyway, I took the liberty to respond (in hindsight probably shouldn't have; still learning how to allow the Holy Spirit to control my desire to defend myself, my tongue, and my typing fingers) in the off chance that it wasn't rhetorical.
As always, I hope everyone knows how grateful I am for this ministry, this forum, and for all of you. Your constant prayers, support, in-depth and insightful comments (even if in opposition to my own) are greatly appreciated and I've learned (continue to learn) so much from all of you -- thank you.
God bless you all!
Saved By Grace Through Faith,
Jeff (JRed)
Jred, Again, thank you so much for your hard work. You always make us think! I've been disturbed by the "Pray for Obama - psalm 109" e-mail that has been circulating since I received it myself last week. I've been giving it some thought and I think we need to be careful about batting around scripture which we've isolated from its original context and apart from other related scripture to make our political point. Jesus said to pray for those in leadership above us an (I don't think that means calling down a curse on them) and we're also of course, admonished to pray for our enemies. I'm not a theologian, but, I think Psalm 109 is best left as a prophetic judgment from God. Tossing it out as a slogan on a bumpersticker or a "gotcha type e-mail" is not worthy of the word of G-d. At least that is my humble opinion. Great discernment is needed in these last days. Not everything that comes along is a good idea. I agree with Gibby,
I think real civil disobedience is found less in sticks and stones and more in standing for righteousness in an honorable way. In these days of increasing darkness, hate and confusion. I'm praying that the light and love of Jesus will shine brighter than before. Joy to the world, the Lord has come! It was good news then, and its good news now. Keep up the good work JRed and have a wonderful thanksgiving!
Hi Jred,
I am the anonymous who begs the question "who do WE serve?" Is your mom part of the patriot movement...probably not...but she was put in a position where she HAD to take a STAND, there was no room for compromise and the stakes were high...it could have cost her, her livlihood...or her health. There was no compromise. NO KING but KING JESUS. Her body belongs to Christ and the government and her employer have no right to make claim to what she has pledged to another. I think that she and we are part of the "restrainer" that is holding back the man of sin. We are living in a unique time in history but let Jesus judge our actions as we commit our lives to HIM, not our jobs, our security, or government promises. Some things are out of OUR control but nothing is out of HIS control. I got to think Jesus is rather proud of your mom and the medical people who stood up and said NO, I think they have bought us all a little more time. As anxious as I am to go home and my spirit calls "come, Lord Jesus, come" I know many people who are not saved and Christianity is best when it is couragious and counter culture. What your mom did and what other Christians are doing in standing up and being counted is definately not luke warm. I think it is contagious. What the enemy plans for bad Jesus will use for good. I don't know anyone in the tea party movement that wants revolutionary war but I do hear the war cry from the left. I read on one blog someone saying they wanted healthcare reform so they could have forced abortions for the Christians. It's coming. Just not yet. Not as long as the salt is salty. And when they try to shut up free speech and the internet, I feel encouraged that we won't just let it happen. If anyone starts shooting it will be the facist, communists who see us as standing in their way. But all we will get is a ticket home and our blood will be the seed of the martyrs. WE didn't start the fire, but we are not afraid of it either. Come Lord Jesus Come.
I can only guess that some people are genuinely fearful and that might look like anger when they write. They are being challenged to truly decide, and get off the fence. The events you have been reporting on are tough to swallow in many regards, because they pose a reality check and decision. I'm new here, but wow, you seem to be nailing this stuff!
Here is a sermon that fits this topic well, it's about the Lord Jesus Christ being our only sure foundation. This is a great sermon worth listening to for this reason.
http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?SID=1123082050185
JRed, this may very well have been your most important message yet. After reading all the comments I'm convinced that Christians are all thinking about the ramifications of what's obviously happening. There is no denying prophecy now. Now it's all a matter of choice and most folks don't like having to choose. You know..the old "what's behind door number one" shtick. There is no middle of the road anymore and that tends to make folks angry, especially those who have gotten comfortable being in the middle, going along with plenty of space on both sides...just in case mentality. No sir, you aren't causing strife or division. It already existed. Satan has been working at that for a long long time. As one of our fellow Christians stated in a comment...we each must do what we are compelled to do. HIS ways are not our ways..HIS plan is perfect and I for one will not cast dispersions on anyone for their choices...especially someone who openly claims to be for God and Christ. You've done a marvelous thing brother. God must surely bless you for it.
Agree JRed - there is a spiritual undercurrent that is driving all we are witnessing.
I have also noticed something rather interesting that falls into line with what you have pointed out. Among those promoting and overhaul of the government there is concurrently an attack against all things Christian.
In one particular forum that promotes liberty, etc. there has been an increasing number of postings that challenge the Bible and Christianity - the rhetoric being quite hateful in nature. I find it quite offensive but refrain from engaging the various authors in any kind of meaningful debate. There is no debate in their minds and as the fight for liberty goes forward so should the destruction of anything promoting Biblical principles. One so crudely wrote that his belief in the Bible was; "I believe it would make a great paperweight".
Ha, ha...
Every knee shall bow...
As you said, prayer is our most powerful recourse. Prayer for many eyes to be opened to the Truth and that many may come to Christ before the last 7 years of history (Daniel's 70th week) begins.
We are watching the final touches put in place for this prophetic time period to be initiated - hold on Church!
Sincerely,
LK
Great post & warning.
This is pretty clear don't you think?
Revelation 13:10 If anyone is destined for captivity, to captivity he goes; if anyone kills with the sword, with the sword he must be killed. Here is the perseverance and the faith of the saints.
Matt 26:52 Jesus said to him, "Put your sword back in its place! Everyone who uses a sword will be killed by a sword.
Plus- How can we be an earthen vessel for the Holy Spirit to work through us if we're physically killed? There are many miraculous events which have taken place even within the walls of a prison.
Nowhere in scripture does it say that we should resist evil until we're pretty sure we're in the "end times". Nope, it just says that we are to resist evil, and I for one will do that until I'm taken out of this life one way or the other. Many people in the patriot movement, myself included, are born again Christians. We really are in a spiritual battle, one that has been foretold in prophecy. Quite frankly, I find it hard to believe that most Christians are perfectly willing to let Satan steamroll over us all. What happened to "Onward, Christian Soldiers, marching as to war with the cross of Jesus going on before"? This is war, and Christians need to get up and fight for their children and grandchildren, and more importantly their right to their freedom of religion. Notice that this world is doing it's best to silence Christianity in these last days. Remember Who wins! If you don't put up a fight, shame on you. Prayer requires follow-up action for it to be any good. So pray and ask whether or not you should be joining the "fight". If you won't join the fight, then please intercede for those who are fighting this spiritual battle on your behalf.
Anonymous #26,
That's a good perspective and definitely food for serious thought. Actually, I like a couple of things you wrote that I want to quickly address.
But first, I still don't get how relying on God and prayer is synonymous with 'letting Satan steamroll' us. Maybe I'll start a new Bible study on Daniel b/c that was a guy who was the prototype for Christian patriots I think given his distaste for politics and the regime at the time.
And to the other brother/sister in Christ who mentioned my mom, yes, of course I commend her (and others like her) for that decision. If you recall, I was the one encouraging people to reject mandated vaccines then and even now and I won't take them either if I'm told I have to. 'Taking a stand' is one thing, but acting impulsively without praying and asking God what to do first is unbiblical and that's what I'm trying to get across in this message.
In any event, I liked what you wrote: 'So pray and ask whether or not you should be joining the 'fight'' because that's exactly it.
I should clarify something that I think needs to be said.
It's doesn't seem to be a case of 'you're right if you do this' or 'you're wrong if you do that' when it comes to the 'hands-on protest vs. passive protest' debate.
Maybe it's more about how we as Christians need to understand what the end result will be depending on the path we choose because as LNL pointed out:
Revelation 13:10 If anyone is destined for captivity, to captivity he goes; if anyone kills with the sword, with the sword he must be killed. Here is the perseverance and the faith of the saints.
Matthew 26:52 Jesus said to him, "Put your sword back in its place! Everyone who uses a sword will be killed by a sword.
We're all Christians. We all believe that prayer is the first weapon we use in this battle. Depending on the effect of wielding that weapon in the first salvo, our Lord will give each of us our own unique 'marching orders', and each person who follows His lead will be right -- as long as it's really Him who's doing the leading.
God will use us to fulfill His purposes whether we're led into captivity or fighting in the streets in hand-to-hand combat.
Thanks for taking the time to write, and yes, I am praying for you.
God Bless,
Jeff (JRed)
I think all are called to fight evil through prayer. And I also think some are called to fight evil through action (not that prayer isn't an action...you know what I mean). It can mean protest or speaking out in general. Or it could mean civil disobedience in some fashion.
I (as a CPA) have been thinking hard about the ramifications of funding for abortion being mandated in a health care bill. My tax dollars going to fund abortions??? I don't think so.
Many things to think and pray about.
Thanks for the post and your work in general.
Wow. Awesome post, Jred. And wonderful, thought-provoking comments everyone.
My husband and I have been having discussions similar to this. We know there have been some called to war and some called to simply stand (throughout the Bible).
The one account that keeps getting laid on my heart is the Battle of Jericho. While the Israelites were active they were not antagonistic nor violent. They simply kept their faith in God. They did what the Lord told them to do. They were active when they "marched." They were active when they blew their horns. But it was all done according to God's will, which is not chaotic but organized and for His glory.
Another thing is the Armor of God. Even though we have this armor, there are two interesting things about it. First, Paul tells us why God has given us this armor...TO STAND our ground.
the second is that most of the Armor given to protect us is defensive. It's not created to help us advance the kingdom and overtake the evil one--only God can do that. But it is designed to help us stand strong and withstand to the end. Take the Breastplate of Righteousness...if you look at it's physical counterpart, a breastplate will not keep your extremities from getting banged up but it will protect your vital organs. It is not made to fight, but to protect. It helps you stand. Just as God's righteousness helps us when the enemy comes against us. We make our stand and it protects us from death blows the enemy might make.
The only part of the armor that is truly "offensive" versus defensive is offensive to those who will not hear or see...the TRUTH. Jesus told us He was the Way, the Truth and the Life. He is our sword, He is our Truth. And Jesus offends those who do not love Him. His Word (Bible), while the most comprehensive guide to history and moral truth, is one of the most hated books in the world because it is of God.
As we are all different parts of the body, we have our callings.
The important thing is that we all remember to pray without ceasing and to seek God's will in all that we do.
And Jred...those brothers and sisters that are angry, I agree with the others. Anger comes from offense. They are offended at what you have to say. Often times offense is created because that person is under conviction for something and not wanting to deal with it. Not saying that's the case, but even the world senses something is going on. Just pray for them, pray with love and understanding. There is nothing more you can do but go to the Father. He knows what's best for everyone. And He knows that this might be testing your faith and stretching you to make that STand.
Always,
K & T Zimmer
As I mentioned in a previous comment, this one is getting a lot of attention, brother. It's the quintessential decision of our time. The spirit will move all of God's children one way or another, according to his perfect plan. Smile and rest on the decisions you make. Don't worry about others and their decisions. All we can do is speak the Gospel and hope that it falls on ears that hear. Regardless or our decisions, as long as we choose Christ as our best friend and savior we will all meet someday in much happier circumstances.
Just chalk this up under "Signs of the Times". Sting offers a 'spooky, ghostly' seasonal album.
I think you just hit the nail on the head, Jeff. We really can't broad brush (any of us, including me) others' motivations, particularly if God is in it.
I know in my spirit and when God first led me to do what I do, that it was partly a realization that it was evil behind starving children in third world countries set up for collapse by certain people... and that this was coming to the United States.
Jesus was the original one to upset the bankers in the temple and while I am not Jesus, I, too, feel that it is prayer ..and physical action (not violence)... that needs to be done by myself.
My mind has been going back to the times of Nazi Germany when the Christians did nothing to help the Jews who were carted off to the death camps..and while we do not see this yet in America- it IS happening in poorer countries, children being starved to death before their parents eyes. Yes, we should pray...but we should also stand against tyranny.
And, in my heart, I have known for about five years that should the world keep turning that I will, indeed, give up my life for this cause, rather than old age.
That is as it should be. But, each of us (as you pointed out Jeff) should not judge one way or the other, if God is in it.
Keep up the good work, Jeff.
Bruce
"Wearing out the Saints" is what it seems you have described
Today the news came out that three navy seals are in trouble for roughing up a terrorist. Most of us are up at arms about this. And waiting three months for our troops to have the needed troops to protect themselves is another reason to be upset. Wearing out the Saints is how I feel about what is happening. Good eye J for seeing this.
Daniel 7:25 (AMP)
25 And he shall speak words against the Most High [God] and shall wear out the saints of the Most High and think to change the time [of sacred feasts and holy days] and the law; and the saints shall be given into his hand for a time, two times, and half a time [three and one-half years].